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Thread: Brass "scratch-aid" kits (Worsley)

  1. #11
    Senior Member jhb171achill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colin R View Post
    So do I have this right then that very little Dublin & South Eastern Railway rolling stock survived after the formation of the GSR?

    Colin
    I wouldn't say very little immediately after the formation, but while much GSWR and MGWR stuff got transferred onto the South Eastern, not so much DSER stock went elsewhere. While I can't quote actual statistics, I do know that by 1950 a large proportion of DSER stock is no longer listed as being on the books. Then, over 1951/2, CIE build a lot of new stock, thus cascading more six-wheelers from elsewhere onto Bray - Amiens St & Harcourt St services.

    By the mid 50s, the DSER is a mix of new CIE, the odd Bredin, brand new Park Royals, and a mixture (especially in terms of suburban six-wheelers) of DSER, GSWR and MGWR stock.

    By the late 50s, most surviving pre-1925 main line or bogie stock is GSWR, while surviving six wheelers, as excursion / branch line / peak period stock, appear to be mostly MGWR, but many GSWR types still lurking.

    For Mayner's 650 class kit - or indeed any MGWR prototype - or just about any steam loco in CIE days, even into the diesel "C" class era, the solid old wooden Midland six-wheeler is not only compatible, it's as good as obligatory.

    By 1959, very few DSER coaches at all exist.

    And - crucially - for a DSER modeller, since ex-DSER stock (a) became rarer quicker, and (b) seem to have remained on home territory, the following conclusions can be drawn:

    1. Only a DSER loco, or a Midland of GSWR one know to have worked the DSER line, is properly or normally compatible with DSER stock. CIE being the hotchpotch working museum that it was, I'm sure there was the odd exception, but that would be the general idea.

    2. A layout based elsewhere is not the most realistic place for a DSER coach! Again, the odd exception might happen, such as a GAA special from, say, Wexford to Thurles!
    “An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it. Truth stands, even if there be no public support”

    Never argue with an idiot. He will bring you down to his level, then beat you with experience.

  2. #12
    Senior Member jhb171achill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiveController View Post
    Would they be suitable for a certain brass kit due for release late 2017, a MGWR Ks/GSR 650 Class with superheated round topped boiler round canopy cab, open coal rails tender as running 1916-Mid 1930s or in its later CIE condition?
    Not only suitable, but in a Midland days these engines pulled little else in passenger trains! It's like a new 071 and Mk 2s on a layout based in 1985!

    In GSR days, same story exactly. In CIE days, obviously every steam or diesel loco hauled passenger trains consisting of ancient and modern, everything from the oldest then in traffic (1877 six wheeler) to brand new laminates, but these MGWR six wheeled yokes were very much in there among them.

    Former MGWR stock made it all over the GSWR and DSER, and were regulars in West Cork right until closure, with a couple of old six-wheeled brake thirds still on the Drimoleague - Baltimore line (along with one or two equally venerable antiques of GSWR parentage).

    At least one managed to hop onto the Tramore line. Six were borrowed by the Belfast & Co Down in the mid 1910s.
    “An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it. Truth stands, even if there be no public support”

    Never argue with an idiot. He will bring you down to his level, then beat you with experience.

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by jhb171achill View Post

    By 1959, very few DSER coaches at all exist.

    And - crucially - for a DSER modeller, since ex-DSER stock (a) became rarer quicker, and (b) seem to have remained on home territory, the following conclusions can be drawn:
    Did they get withdrawn not long after '25 like a share of DSER locos, with being clapped out or written off during the Civil War?

  4. #14
    Senior Member jhb171achill's Avatar
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    Firstly, Minister, there were less of them than the other companies. But also, exactly as you suggest, civil war losses and probably arrears of maintenance put paid to more.

    They didn't disappear entirely. Senior remembered their distinctive door handles when commuting on the line between 1922 and 1937, and photos taken in the 1950s still show the odd one.
    “An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it. Truth stands, even if there be no public support”

    Never argue with an idiot. He will bring you down to his level, then beat you with experience.

  5. #15
    Hi JB
    Do you know which type of 6 wheel coaches were used on this opening sequence of the 'Quiet Man' movie?
    Noel


  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by jhb171achill View Post
    Ah! Superb, Andy.

    I didn't know you were doing a period that early - GSR layouts are (to my knowledge) almost, if not literally non-existent. Both a Valencia / Valentia and a Courtmacsherry prototype would invite quite a hotch-potch of carriages and wagons, almost certainly no two alike! And for 1935 you've all three GSR liveries too, which make for more variety, and make up for nothing but plain grey engines! (Unless 800 is going to make a surprise and premature appearance!)...

    Both should be extremely interesting projects - good luck!
    Bit more than should,Valencia has been exhibited for the last 5 or so years and featured in Model Rail August 2014.Courtmacsherry is due at the Warley show next year.I had Valencia at Warminster the other week and gave both Argadeen and St Mologa a bit of a running session on it.800 you won't be seeing as i've done 802(everyone seems to do 800)trouble is that her and 7 Bredins do tend to clog up the station.Andy.

  7. #17
    Senior Member jhb171achill's Avatar
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    I'd love to see that in the flesh, Andy...

    Noel - the carriages in that clip are all GSWR 1885-95 period. Wayne gets out of a "lavatory composite", i.e. with a loo accessible to the two first class compartments, but not the thirds at the ends! Same era & origin of coach.
    “An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it. Truth stands, even if there be no public support”

    Never argue with an idiot. He will bring you down to his level, then beat you with experience.

  8. #18
    Hi jhb

    Just to update you with my 6W chassis endeavours as I mentioned on one of your previous 6 Wheeler threads;-

    I now have a Worsley 'Wayne' coach- a LavComp, I have been collecting parts to work up the plan.
    Name:  6W ECMCHAS-01 IMAG3133.jpg
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    13'' sprung buffers and MJT 6 Wheel Compensated W Iron Kit with free central axle on brass wires, 8ft springs are out of stock at the moment which is holding up things a bit..
    Name:  6W ECMCHAS-03 IMAG3131.jpg
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    and a pcb board chassis plate to fit this kit..
    Name:  6W ECMCHAS-02 IMAG3132.jpg
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    A drawing is been worked on but I would like to have the springs in hand to finalise, I'm not sure yet if I'm using the Worsley W Irons n gear! as I feel the MJT kit is easier! Decisions, Decisions...

    Do you know that SSM do a number of 6 Wheeler kits?

    Eoin
    Last edited by murrayec; 30-06-2017 at 06:08 PM.
    www.ecmtrains.com - Manufacturing the Model Dart

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by jhb171achill View Post
    I'd love to see that in the flesh, Andy...

    Noel - the carriages in that clip are all GSWR 1885-95 period. Wayne gets out of a "lavatory composite", i.e. with a loo accessible to the two first class compartments, but not the thirds at the ends! Same era & origin of coach.
    Not Valencia i'm afraid but i should be bringing Castlederg over to Cultra next year.Andy

  10. #20
    Senior Member Mayner's Avatar
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    SSM produce complete kits for 4 types of GSWR 6 wheel coach 1st, 1,2,3rd Comp, 3rd and 3rd brake

    The kits are probably an easier starting point than using the Worsley Works scratch aids and sourcing castings, bearings, seats and other parts.

    MGWR coaches are on the JM Design to do list
    John


    If I was going there I would'nt be starting here.

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